This November, on the occasion of World Day of Romani Language, a delegation of the National Romani Self-Government of Hungary visited Zagreb. During their visit—through the mediation of organization member Balász Kelemen—we spoke with the organization’s president, István Aba-Horváth, about the structure of their organization, the position of Roma in Hungary, and a new law that directly threatens the housing rights of Roma.
At the beginning, could you please say something about your organization?
Our organization, the National Romani Self-Government of Hungary (Magyarországi Romák Országos Önkormányzata) holds the status of the national municipality and enjoys the autonomous rights for language, culture and education. The president of the organization is István Aba-Horváth, and he is the highest elected Romani representative in the country. The law says that our function is to take care of the Romani heritage and culture. That is the official duty. But the Romani people in Hungary want us and need us to help them with the everyday struggle. We have around 1200 local Romani governments and they receive the funds from the Hungarian government to do the job in the field. They have the same responsibility as us, mainly Romani heritage and culture, but on the local level. The funds they receive are not enough for all the needs of the people. Generally speaking, there is not enough funding and not enough legal opportunities to improve the living conditions. Since our main tasks are Romani language and culture, we cannot really take care of the language and culture without taking care of the basic needs. If we could have more funding, we could do much more. The opportunities are now minimal.
So, is your organization the non-governmental organisation or a state institution?
The Hungarian government provides each year approximately 1,7 million euros for us to function. We get our funding for the governing body, where we have 47 elected officials. We have an office which helps to govern the decision-making body. And we have four institutions. One is a charity, one is for sports, one for the media and culture, and one for the employment of Romani people. With this fourth institution, we lead our own projects and give advice to the Government.
How would you, in short, describe the position of the Roma in Hungary today? Is the overall position improving? What are the main challenges?
When we look at the entire Europe, the Hungarian government is one of the brightest examples of the sum it provides for the Romani community. It is around 250 million euros per year. That includes all programs. Unfortunately, we, as the Hungarian Romani Self-Government, cannot access these funds because other institutions are deciding what they will use this money for. Actually, they are the ones who are using the money. The State Secretary for Social Opportunities and Roma Relations, who is a Roma, is the one who decides how to spend these funds. On the other side, most members of the Romani community are under-educated, they do not have a proper job trainings, and they have a lot of disadvantages on the labour market. They live on the edges of towns, they are marginalized, and the programs directed towards them a lot of times do not reach them properly. There are a few areas and towns where they do large projects, but it is not adequately geographically distributed. Some of the trainings are not giving them real opportunities. The projects have good elements, there will be some results, but the efficiency of the projects would be much better with a better cooperation between parties, because at the moment there is no meaningful cooperation between them.
The one side are the representatives of the Roma communities. And who is the other side?
The other side is the State Secretary. Five or ten years ago, there would be no huge projects without the cooperation between the two parties – the State Secretary and the Roma representatives. Right now, the State Secretary has decided not to work with us. He created an institution which he can manage himself.
Are you satisfied with the work that is being done for the Romani community? Has the situation improved with the Hungarian membership in the European Union?
The majority of these funds are from the EU, around 80 percent, so yes, it helped a lot. For those who are the beneficiaries of the programs based on these funds, the situation has improved. But the people who are not beneficiaries of these programs, for them the situation is not so good. We, as an organization and Mr Aba-Horváth as its president, are trying to be at service for both sides, for beneficiaries and non-beneficiaries of the programs.
Are there Roma representatives in high politics in Hungary?
The State Secretary in the Government is Roma, and in the opposition parties, three members of the Parliament are Roma. Unfortunately, there is no cooperation between them.
In Croatia, one of the biggest problems is school segregation. What is the situation in Hungary regarding that?
According to the ombudsman for minorities, school segregation is also a big problem. There is a new law in Hungary which allows local governments and city councils to make a local regulation on who can buy property on their territory. The ombudsman wrote about that as well, because some city councils use that regulation to indirectly stop Roma from creating their homes at their territories. For example, if a person has ever been fined by the police or has been to jail, he or she will not be able to buy a house. Or if someone is not educated enough. They can even have an interview with you to check whether you are suitable to live in the territory. So this is maybe a bigger challenge than the school segregation.
Does in Hungary live a subgroup of Roma called Bayash? If yes, what is their social status? Is there any difference in their living conditions compared to other groups?
In Hungary, there are four groups of Romani people – Bayash, Sinti, Lovari and Romungro (Hungarian Roma). The latter group speaks Hungarian, not the Romani language. Because of their traditions, the groups are not closely connected to each other. In the end, if you live in poverty or in a disadvantaged area, it is not important which group you belong to, since you can hardly break that negative circle. A lot of people from each group are very well-positioned, and at the same time, for people who are not close to the funds, it does not matter which group you belong to; you will be left out.
